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Sexual Harassment in Wrestling?

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#Heel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22/January/2018 at 22:30
I think it’s wrong if they suspend him at this moment

The phrase over here is innocent until proven guilty. Surely by suspending him there’s that doubt - they are basically saying they think he’s guilty.

If he is proven guilty then he absolutely should lose his job and serve whatever sentence they throw at him

These accusations (if false) will no doubt make him guilty in people’s minds whatever the outcome so that’s a shame if he is intact innocent
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tom Colohue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22/January/2018 at 22:38
WWE are not saying that. Court of public opinion will say that but a suspension exists in order to comply with the law. It's also not an indefinite suspension, meaning that if exonerated he'll be permitted to continue.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22/January/2018 at 22:40
Originally posted by Tom Colohue Tom Colohue wrote:

WWE are not saying that. Court of public opinion will say that but a suspension exists in order to comply with the law. It's also not an indefinite suspension, meaning that if exonerated he'll be permitted to continue.



why does he need to be suspended in order to comply with the law?

Why can they not investigate whilst he is employed - so long as he co-operates?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MUSA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22/January/2018 at 22:53
 

Edited by MUSA - 29/January/2018 at 02:59
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22/January/2018 at 22:59
Originally posted by MUSA MUSA wrote:

I concur. Suspension means that he makes less money and is served punishment before ever being tried. This is just WWEs way of placating to the public. I'm so damn sick of this world's abuse of public opinion. For example - It's easy to make people flee a flight when you cry TERRORIST, it's harder to pause and see where the accused is. It seems like everyone does this whole "accuse and try in the same sentence...just in case" which is absolutely nonsense and goes against everything our history fought for.

100% this

WWE suspending Enzo is as good as them saying "He's guilty"

All they had to do was give him some time off to co-operate until the case is resolved.

Over here, the only time someone would be suspended from their job, is if the accusation was involving two colleagues and both would be suspended pending investigation - because of the atmosphere within the workplace.

WWE, as you have stated, are appeasing the public who will be all over this saying that he should be sacked etc etc without actually getting any facts

I still maintain that if he is guilty then he 100% should lose his job but he should at this minute in time, be allowed to still do his job (if the plan was for him to retain his title, then he should still retain) and then act accordingly if he is found guilty. Its not as if they would struggle to explain why he was stripped of the title when it will be public knowledge he is under investigation
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kondor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/January/2018 at 05:51
Originally posted by #Heel #Heel wrote:

I think it’s wrong if they suspend him at this moment

The phrase over here is innocent until proven guilty. Surely by suspending him there’s that doubt - they are basically saying they think he’s guilty.

If he is proven guilty then he absolutely should lose his job and serve whatever sentence they throw at him

These accusations (if false) will no doubt make him guilty in people’s minds whatever the outcome so that’s a shame if he is intact innocent

Originally posted by MUSA MUSA wrote:

I concur. Suspension means that he makes less money and is served punishment before ever being tried. This is just WWEs way of placating to the public. I'm so damn sick of this world's abuse of public opinion. For example - It's easy to make people flee a flight when you cry TERRORIST, it's harder to pause and see where the accused is. It seems like everyone does this whole "accuse and try in the same sentence...just in case" which is absolutely nonsense and goes against everything our history fought for.

I am going to fully agree with #Heel and MUSA. As #Heel said, there is a difference between quietly removing someone from the workplace while an investigation is underway versus public outing them and thus altering public opinion on the accused before due process has taken place. I saw the WWE's statement on the accusation (and that's all it is now is an accusation) about having "zero tolerance for sexual assault" with a big picture of Enzo there. The WWE is acting grossly irresponsible in this manner by causing a link in people's minds of Enzo Amore to sexual assault. Just as said, this will negatively hinder Enzo's public image regardless of the outcome of the case or regardless of the actual validity of the accusation. 

I do generally tend to side with the accuser in matters of charges (legal or just verbal) of sexual assault. But I also say that every case needs to be looked into; and there are some some who completely fabricate a story for either money or fame, or both. Those instances are few and far between, and give a bad name to legit cases. 

I am not going to comment at this time on the actual accusations as #1 I was not there and #2 I have not researched the case. Nor do I even fully trust the judicial system. But at least we have a justice system of some kind where the accused are judged by their peers. Also as stated by others  like #Heel, we have a system of innocent until proven guilty. The WWE is making Enzo appear guilty in the court of public opinion. But of course they are a publicly traded company and have to cover their own ass. 

It's the same shit in football in the NFL when they suspend a player at the first sign of an accusation. They use the personal conduct policy as an excuse; but it's still circumventing due process either way.      

This incident with Enzo Amore reminds me of the WWF doing the exact same thing with Jerry Lawler in 1993. If you remember Lawler was in his big feud with Bret Hart and was supposed to face the Hart brothers with his Knights at the Survivor Series that year. But a young girl accused him of rape and the WWF suspended him, taking him out of the Survivor Series (of course replaced by Shawn Michaels.) So even back in '93 the WWF would do suspend somebody once publicly accused. But there were inconsistencies in the girl's story, the charges were dropped, and Lawler was reinstated in the WWF. Outside of when he quit for the Kat in 2001 he's been there ever since. 

Very few bring up this Lawler accusation today even though the King is known as a womanizer. Lawler is revered and seen as a legend in both the ring and the broadcasting booth. So someone can recover their image, especially over time. But this is a different world today than 1993. People are getting more aware of legit sexual assault as a societal problem. People are also defining more things as being sexual assault, right or wrong (that is of course a whoooooole other conversation.) Sexual predators are (rightfully) outcasts from civilized society. So even if innocent Enzo may have a tougher time clearing his name than Lawler. Thus the WWE is acting irresponsibly right now by painting Enzo as a sexual predator.

And the fact that Enzo isn't overly liked in the locker room can't help matters. 

This all reminds me of the quote by Al Pacino from The Godfather Part II (1974), "I challenge this committee to produce any evidence or witness against me. And if they do not, I hope they have the decency to clear my name with the same publicity with which they now have besmirched it."     

And none of my post is a comment of the guilt or innocence of neither Lawler in 1993 nor Enzo now; just a comment about due process. 

Also, how can we have a whole thread about "sexual assault in wrestling" without bringing up Pat Patterson and Mel Phillips? 


Edited by Kondor - 23/January/2018 at 06:04

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote L-shizzel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/January/2018 at 08:36
By suspending him they give the idea that he's guilty, there's no real proof of anything besides what was posted on twitter and if I read right this person is pretty sketchy to begin with, in saying that I am not going to say that she is faking the story because anything is possible. 

What would've been better is if he was given time off until the situation was settled and maybe have an off screen injury angle so they can get the cruiserweight title off of him as well. 


As for sexual harassment itself whether it is in wrestling or any kind of work, or sport it is not on anyone who can't handle being told no should be fired and even cop some jail time depending on the extent of the harassment. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/January/2018 at 19:01
He's now been released....must be more to this story that will be coming out in the next few days,

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/January/2018 at 19:06
Originally posted by Baz Baz wrote:

He's now been released....must be more to this story that will be coming out in the next few days,

Holy Shit - that escalated real quick

There can only be some substantial evidence because there cant even have been enough time to do a thorough investigation into this allegation 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/January/2018 at 19:08
Originally posted by #Heel #Heel wrote:

Originally posted by Baz Baz wrote:

He's now been released....must be more to this story that will be coming out in the next few days,

Holy Shit - that escalated real quick

There can only be some substantial evidence because there cant even have been enough time to do a thorough investigation into this allegation 

That's my thinking too. All in less than 24 hours. He's either admitted to something or WWE's lawyers told the powers that be he needs to go as he's unlikely to get away with anything. Saves them paying a wage whilst he's suspended too if that's the likely outcome.

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