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Phil "CM Punk" Brooks in UFC

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#Heel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 10:21
Not sure what hype you are even on about? He was never hyped up in UFC - he was always expexted to lose

Your comment about main eventers having to be able to legit beat people up is moronic - alot of the current WWE roster would be destroyed equally as easily in MMA.

What is worth reading though is Cory Graves tweets seemingly aimed at Punk immediately after his loss - hes had a right go
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote admin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 10:34
Originally posted by #Heel #Heel wrote:

Not sure what hype you are even on about? He was never hyped up in UFC - he was always expexted to lose

Your comment about main eventers having to be able to legit beat people up is moronic - alot of the current WWE roster would be destroyed equally as easily in MMA.

What is worth reading though is Cory Graves tweets seemingly aimed at Punk immediately after his loss - hes had a right go
 
His hype in E that he had lots of sheep thinking he should be main eventing Wrestlemania when he moaned about it himself and other stuff he whinged about during his time there.
 
Yes they would but I suspect most current E main eventers with some training would beat the jobber Phil got battered by. It wasn't a case of him losing to guys of a decent level like Lesnar did.
 
Just checked out what Graves tweeted. Good lad using a situation for his own publicity.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 13:33
He'll be back Wrestling before we know it. His UFC media stunt has been complete. Dana won't put him in another fight so all is done for him there.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 14:22
Originally posted by admin admin wrote:

Originally posted by #Heel #Heel wrote:

Not sure what hype you are even on about? He was never hyped up in UFC - he was always expexted to lose

Your comment about main eventers having to be able to legit beat people up is moronic - alot of the current WWE roster would be destroyed equally as easily in MMA.

What is worth reading though is Cory Graves tweets seemingly aimed at Punk immediately after his loss - hes had a right go


<FONT style=": #000000"> 

<FONT style=": #000000">His hype in E that he had lots of sheep thinking he should be main eventing Wrestlemania when he moaned about it himself and other stuff he whinged about during his time there.

<FONT style=": #000000"> 

<FONT style=": #000000">Yes they would but I suspect most current E main eventers with some training would beat the jobber Phil got battered by. It wasn't a case of him losing to guys of a decent level like Lesnar did.

<FONT style=": #000000"> 

<FONT style=": #000000">Just checked out what Graves tweeted. Good lad using a situation for his own publicity.


I don’t agree that wrestling main eventers should be legit hard cases, funnily enough I was having this conversation with a work colleague last night as a guy who has just left where I work is a former wrestler(small time though he used to work the UK carnival circuit)and always used to claim he was hard as nails based on his wrestling background, I said that while wrestling may teach you a few holds that might be handy in a legit fight it’s more about being able to execute moves that look good without actually hurting each other, effectively it’s got more in common with ballet than being in a real life scrap, it’s about skill, timing and athleticism, to say you have to be legit tough is untrue.

However CM Punk always bigged himself up as some sort of Ninja Jedi with training in various martial arts so I’m glad he’s now had his ass handed to him in two MMA fights, served up a little bit of karma after all his arrogant self serving criticism he threw at WWE after they made him a star and a very rich man.

This fight had been booked as something Punk could win and he still got soundly beaten so I think it’s safe to say MMA is not Punks bag, he is surely done with the sport now.
My guess is he will now just retire or return to wrestling. He has other interests like comic book writing so retirement could be a option and he’s banked enough money.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote L-shizzel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 14:41
He's now 40 if he came back he'd be used for enchanchment for the up and comers sort of like how Jericho is used.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rico Len Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 15:16
To Adders point, back in the 50s-80s when there was no UFC or MMA in general, pro-wrestling attracted all the tough guys. I don't think anyone would be stupid enough to say that Haku wouldn't have had a successful career in UFC had it been around back then. There were a lot of guys like Haku back then too, Mark Calaway has said he would probably have gone to UFC instead of wrestling had it been around, and the Steiner brother's likely would have as well, and so would have Road Warrior Animal.

I think a lot of people wonder what a neck-healthy Kurt Angle might have done in MMA. He obviously had skill at grappling and he was smart and able to keep his wits about him in the thick of it.

Brock Lesnar is not an anomaly. Scotty Steiner in particular likely could have gone toe to toe with anyone Lesnar did, and Haku would have killed anyone Lesnar fought.

The only chink in the armor of the clout some of those older guys had was that most of them talked about Andre like a guy you just couldn't touch. Haku was afraid of Andre and Andre was afraid of Haku. Haku seemed to think that Andre could have squashed him like a bug in his heyday. And certainly Andre has had some stories told about him like when he got into a fight with a couple of other wrestlers at his hotel room and they rushed him and he shoved them back so hard they went through the closed sliding glass door window and over the balcony of the 3rd floor. I think it was Heenan telling this story and he said he thought those guys were dead but apparently they held on and climbed back up. That said, Andre wasn't the most mobile guy even when he was young and healthy, and aside from being almost inhumanly strong he wasn't that great a fighter, so that makes everything else people talk about suspect.

Point being here, wrestlers were known badasses back then. They got in street fights and bar fights all the time, especially guys like Haku and Piper. Nowadays wrestlers brag about their conditioning and athletic prowess, but they sit in the locker room playing video games and when a real fight comes up, they get their asses kicked. Times changed so much not just in the WWE but in MMA as well.

And then there is the one former MMA fighter was banging a reality era porn star/wrestler and who bitch slapped a racist suit and got fired for it, and now everyone hates him for his lifestyle. I'm of course referring to Alberto Del Rio. Yet another example of how times have changed between then and now.

Times have changed, not just for the locker room, but the fans as well. All I think Adders is getting at is that it was nice when wrestlers had this aura to them like they could beat anyone in a real fight (granted it was born mostly of ignorance, but still), and in these days wrestlers would have to be able to hold their own in the UFC in order to maintain that same aura from back then. That is exactly why Brock Lesnar is champion right now. And that is exactly why CM Punk is in the doghouse with a big number of fans. Lesnar proved he could do it. Punk proved he couldn't. At least Daniel Bryan chased down a robber and stuck him in a submission hold until the police could arrive, even that is more meaningful than 2 losses against MMA nobodies in the eyes of many wrestling fans.

EDIT: I was on my phone writing and I just woke up. I don't even know what I was writing, so I edited this to make more sense...


Edited by Rico Len - 10/June/2018 at 23:07
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 16:36
Wrestling was a different business back then, it was gritty and grimy and yeah there were a lot of legitimate tough guys, I think you had to be tough just to withstand the punishment and the schedule. These days the ring style has evolved so talent can protect themselves and its more about athleticism and fast paced action than two big lumps slugging it out.

I agree about the names Rico mentioned, Haku was said to a absolute animal who everyone was terrified of, if he’d been able to go into MMA while in his prime he would have been a top attraction.

Scott Steiner was a known tough guy with amateur wrestling credentials, during his prime he could have had just as successful a MMA career as Lesnar, a Brock vs Steiner fight in UFC would have been money, I would have liked to have seen these two tear it up in a wrestling ring too.

Andre was just about his shear size, because he was more than double the mass of even a large built human being he just had ridiculous size and strength. I don’t think he could have survived in a legit fight environment.

Other names who I could have seen going into MMA if the opportunity was there are The Undertaker, Goldberg, Samoa Joe and of course Kurt Angle who did consider it but by that point his body was breaking down and I think he knew he couldn’t cut it and it would damage his reputation.

UFC would never do this but there may be money in a promotion arranging a few MMA fights between former grapplers like some of the names mentioned.

Edited by Fletch - 10/June/2018 at 17:19
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 16:49
People really need to think about what they are posting before pressing that "Post Reply" button.

It doesnt matter how badass these guys came across as or how respected they were in the locker room - they are in a land of make believe, where anything is possible.

Even the comment about Bryan chasing the guy down and holding him until police got there is invalid and shouldnt be used in this topic.

Punk was legit fighting people who were trained fighters. Yes, in terms of UFC, they were nobodies but they were still trained in the art of MMA.

Holding a randomer down who has had no training is not comparible in any way shape or form.

The point about Lesnar is that he received training and initially fought in UFC when be was younger, Punk is 40. Lesnar is also a heavyweight and anyone who knows anything about combat sports know that heavyweights carry a legit punchers chance just because of his size and he even lost his UFC debut and got a title shot based on his name/hype from WWE.

Whilst superstars such as Haku would have looked badass no one can say for certain hed have done anything against people who have trained in MMA, BJJ etc

There is not one person on the current roster you could say that about - not one.

The fact is, anyone can (and so it should be) be built up to be a legit champion in WWE because of the nature of the company. People currently complain that sometimes results just wouldnt happen - if WWE employed the MMA rules etc youd find far more people winning matches that you wouldnt expect.

The number of undefeated MMA stars is very very low because in that environment anyone can beat anyone.

Using the logic you guys are using on here, we should have no WWE champion because not one superstar on the roster could you say, yep he could beat everyone else up in a real fight. For all you know, Punk could beat everyone on the current roster in an MMA fight.

The 2 should be kept as they are meant to be - WWE is sports entertainment, UFC is Mixed Martial Arts - there are HUGE differences.

Punk deserves credit for at least having the balls to give it a go


Edited by #Heel - 10/June/2018 at 17:14
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John The Baptist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 18:17
He had 4 years of training for this by one of the best striking coaches in the game yet got thrashed by two rookies who in any normal circumstances wouldn't have even got on the worst years of TUF.

His problem is lack of athleticism, I don't doubt he has tremendous work ethic. You can teach BJJ and striking to a certain level of competence but if you're a late starter you're fairly fucked.

UFC gained very little from this deal IMO. Look at the fight card from last night. Every one of the Fight Pass prelims was better than Punks fight. It's a sham.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/June/2018 at 18:24
Originally posted by John The Baptist John The Baptist wrote:

He had 4 years of training for this by one of the best striking coaches in the game yet got thrashed by two rookies who in any normal circumstances wouldn't have even got on the worst years of TUF.

His problem is lack of athleticism, I don't doubt he has tremendous work ethic. You can teach BJJ and striking to a certain level of competence but if you're a late starter you're fairly fucked.

UFC gained very little from this deal IMO. Look at the fight card from last night. Every one of the Fight Pass prelims was better than Punks fight. It's a sham.

I 100% agree with you, the fight was a joke and even Dana himself said it should have been on Fight Pass.

My main point is that just because Punk got schooled in MMA does not mean that it proves WWE was wrong to make him Champion.

Adders seems to think that you need to be a legit badass to be a WWE champion when infact anyone can be as it is based on totally different things.

There are alot of people who would never fight in MMA, regardless of how much training theyve had, because of how dangerous it is - Punk deserves at least some credit for stepping up plus as you said - he was a late starter so was fucked from the get go.
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