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Finn Balor On Raw

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Fletch View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/November/2017 at 18:47
Originally posted by Baz Baz wrote:

Yes getting Balor away from Raw would be ideal for his career. I also can see why Vince would say that as that's the kind of thing he'd do with smaller guys. Vince still hasn't moved on from this whole genetic jackhammer thing has he haha.


No and I don’t think he ever will, that’s why guys like Cena and Reigns still get pushed to the moon despite the fans cries for guys like Bryan and Balor.

This will only change when Vince becomes too old to be a major decision maker on the creative direction or he when he’s dead.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote #Heel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23/November/2017 at 20:32
Originally posted by Fletch Fletch wrote:

or he when he’s dead.

Don't think that will ever happen, knowing Vince he'll kick out just before the 3 count
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rico Len Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24/November/2017 at 04:15
The problem is that even though fans can point to Daniel Bryan as a huge draw and whatnot, Vince can still reason that even after they gave Bryan his push, he was so small he got broken not even 3 months into his run.

Balor got his push and didn't even last the full match he won the title in.

It is a shitty coincidence, but the evidence goes to Vince regardless. Vince hates it when small guys get injured because he thinks that because they are smaller they break easier. This is what happened to Ziggler, too, if you remember.

Edited by Rico Len - 24/November/2017 at 04:16
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24/November/2017 at 16:53
Originally posted by Rico Len Rico Len wrote:

The problem is that even though fans can point to Daniel Bryan as a huge draw and whatnot, Vince can still reason that even after they gave Bryan his push, he was so small he got broken not even 3 months into his run.

Balor got his push and didn't even last the full match he won the title in.

It is a shitty coincidence, but the evidence goes to Vince regardless. Vince hates it when small guys get injured because he thinks that because they are smaller they break easier. This is what happened to Ziggler, too, if you remember.


On that theory you can see Vinces point and that is likely the reason Dolph Ziggler in particular has never enjoyed a full blown main event push. Ziggler was on the verge of headline status, he’d never been more over and won the World title and turned babyface, but then he got concussion problems, push over.

Daniel Bryan suffered injuries both as World champion and then as Intercontinental champion so again you can understand. Balor had one major match on the main roster and was given the Universal title and in the same match he was shelved for months with a injury.

Fact is the larger guys work a lower risk slower style so they are less likely to get injured, it’s not so much about size it’s about the ring style.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rico Len Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24/November/2017 at 17:07
That's exactly it. It's not their size, it's the damned risks they take. I mean Mr. Perfect was not a small man, but he was small compared to everyone else living in the land of the giants during the 80's and 90's. He was right on the verge of becoming WWE champion, it was all penciled in, and then he got injured. 

By today's standards Perfect would be a big guy, taller than Triple H (who is billed as 6 ft 4in, but in reality is 6ft 2in, while Hennig was a legit 6ft 3in), but that's the same kind of "Small guys are fragile" mentality Vince had clear back then. Randy Savage, Bret Hart & Shawn Michaels are just lucky they never got injured shortly before or after they won their titles, or Vince might never have given smaller wrestlers a chance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24/November/2017 at 19:11
Originally posted by Rico Len Rico Len wrote:

That's exactly it. It's not their size, it's the damned risks they take. I mean Mr. Perfect was not a small man, but he was small compared to everyone else living in the land of the giants during the 80's and 90's. He was right on the verge of becoming WWE champion, it was all penciled in, and then he got injured. 

By today's standards Perfect would be a big guy, taller than Triple H (who is billed as 6 ft 4in, but in reality is 6ft 2in, while Hennig was a legit 6ft 3in), but that's the same kind of "Small guys are fragile" mentality Vince had clear back then. Randy Savage, Bret Hart & Shawn Michaels are just lucky they never got injured shortly before or after they won their titles, or Vince might never have given smaller wrestlers a chance.


Interesting that you make that point about Curt Hennig and the difference in size back in the 80’s/90’s compared to now because I was thinking about that recently. Braun Strowman in today’s WWE dwarfs almost every talent he shares the ring with, he literally looks like a monster hence his monster among men billing, but 25-30 years ago he would have looked normal, at 6’8 Braun is the same height as Hulk Hogan.

Bret Hart is a smaller guy but he worked a very safe style, so this really proves my point, his ring style was low risk and he executed his moves and offence in a way that looked real but didn’t inflict lasting damage. Shawn Michaels worked a faster paced higher risk style but still not at the high impact danger level of Balor or Bryan. As we know HBK did eventually suffer a serious injury but this was after a lot of years in the ring and it was due to a accident, nothing to do with his style of ring work. Michaels was more injury prone after his return but this was probably more to do with his advancing age and more fragile condition due to years of wear and tear. Bret and Shawn got their pushes during a time when WWE were forced to place less emphasis on huge physiques due to the steroids scandal.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tom Colohue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24/November/2017 at 20:02
The report from Sports Ilustrated bears no quote which means even if somebody has said it they're not confident enough to put their name on it. There's no evidence of it being true.

I like the discussion it's got going here though about risks taken and the like. What I will say is that if we're talking about people who take risks and are more prone to injury look at Styles and Rollins. Rollins has had one major injury from something relatively innocuous and meanwhile Styles has a pretty good history in that regard. Those two take immense risks compared to your larger performers. 

I don't think Finn's not over, I just think they wrote a storyline while he was injured and they're seeing it to fruition. The whole point of the Balor/Wyatt feud was to keep both of them in a prominent position and hopefully one of them would rise from the ashes. Balor was never considered to face Lesnar at Rumble; that spot was supposed to be Wyatt's. Wyatt was going to win at TLC and then go on to face Lesnar.

Unfortunately it's Wyatt who's suffered at the wrong time and missed out on a potential big draw match that would have seen him treated like a star.

Balor's time is coming; there's just no room at the top right now. I find it likely he'll be on Smackdown next year putting on great matches with Styles, Nakamura and Rollins.


Edited by Tom Colohue - 24/November/2017 at 20:02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25/November/2017 at 09:34
Originally posted by Tom Colohue Tom Colohue wrote:

The report from Sports Ilustrated bears no quote which means even if somebody has said it they're not confident enough to put their name on it. There's no evidence of it being true.

I like the discussion it's got going here though about risks taken and the like. What I will say is that if we're talking about people who take risks and are more prone to injury look at Styles and Rollins. Rollins has had one major injury from something relatively innocuous and meanwhile Styles has a pretty good history in that regard. Those two take immense risks compared to your larger performers. 

I don't think Finn's not over, I just think they wrote a storyline while he was injured and they're seeing it to fruition. The whole point of the Balor/Wyatt feud was to keep both of them in a prominent position and hopefully one of them would rise from the ashes. Balor was never considered to face Lesnar at Rumble; that spot was supposed to be Wyatt's. Wyatt was going to win at TLC and then go on to face Lesnar.

Unfortunately it's Wyatt who's suffered at the wrong time and missed out on a potential big draw match that would have seen him treated like a star.

Balor's time is coming; there's just no room at the top right now. I find it likely he'll be on Smackdown next year putting on great matches with Styles, Nakamura and Rollins.



Some very good points raised there. Not sure what’s gone wrong with Wyatt, a lot of it is bad timing with injuries and so forth and I think he’s had some personal issues, but ultimately it’s because they just seem to feed him to all the top faces, Cena, Orton and Reigns all emerged victorious over Wyatt, the only times Wyatt has won clean and decisively is against mid-card guys.

As for Balor yes it’s very much a case of getting lost in the shuffle on Raw, he will never leap over guys like Reigns, Strowman, Rollins and the part-timers in the pecking order. A switch to the less superstar heavy Smackdown would be good for him.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tom Colohue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25/November/2017 at 13:30
Originally posted by Fletch Fletch wrote:

Some very good points raised there. Not sure what’s gone wrong with Wyatt, a lot of it is bad timing with injuries and so forth and I think he’s had some personal issues, but ultimately it’s because they just seem to feed him to all the top faces, Cena, Orton and Reigns all emerged victorious over Wyatt, the only times Wyatt has won clean and decisively is against mid-card guys.

As for Balor yes it’s very much a case of getting lost in the shuffle on Raw, he will never leap over guys like Reigns, Strowman, Rollins and the part-timers in the pecking order. A switch to the less superstar heavy Smackdown would be good for him.

I'd agree with most of this. Wyatt was supposed to be feuding with Reigns after mania last year but instead picked up an injury and that's that, in the end. Ultimately his storyline with Randy Orton was very good but a large part of that was that Wyatt rarely wrestled and when he did it was against weaker opponents. 

The problem there, as I saw it, was that WWE didn't expect Wyatt to have the support that he did come the end. They expected that people would be behind Orton's turn and against Wyatt because Wyatt had pinned big names like Styles and Cena. Don't get me wrong; Wyatt was booked very strong as champion. The thing is, they were aiming to make the fans cheer him, else they wouldn't have booked him to pin Reigns the way he did at Survivor Series.

Wyatt could be a big deal again. Ideally I'd like to see Wyatt bring Strowman back into the fold building up to a match at Wrestlemania. Wyatt has all the foreknowledge to beat Strowman without Strowman looking bad at the end of it and it would do very good things for Wyatt. We will see where he goes from here.

Balor I just agree. A move on to a brand with guys who work his style is a must. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fletch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25/November/2017 at 16:21
Yeah when Wyatt won the World title it was the most interested I’ve ever been in him as a character and a wrestler, if WWE had really got behind him during that time and had him successfully retain over Orton then he could have solidified himself as a headliner. It’s very much stop/start booking with Wyatt and they can’t seem to decide if they want him as a faction leader or a solo character, I personally liked the Wyatt Family and don’t know why they seem insistent on keeping them apart. The switch to Raw hasn’t really helped him either, while initially I thought Raw would be a better fit for Bray Wyatt he’s suffering the same problem as Finn Balor, it’s too star heavy and he’s struggling to get ahead of the top guys.
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